FortiCare Renewal for out of support 80C?

[HMB]

Hi All,

We have a FortiWiFi 80C which has been out of support for some time (I guess over a year, although I don't know for sure). I was thinking of getting FortiCare for this box in case something happens.

The problem is that I am unable to find out what it would cost me or how renewing an expired box works. I asked FortiNet support but was pointed to their renewals team which seem to push emails back and forth, apparently unable to give me an answer. I then talked to three FortiNet resellers, and got three different replies. One said that I can just buy the 8x5 1yr FortiCare renewal for my box and I'm set. Another one said that I have to purchase the 2yr package and that FortiNet will backdate support for one year.  And the third reseller told me that once support runs out it can't be renewed.

Can anyone here shed some light on it? Can I put this box back under support, and if so, how?

[hohosecure · Accepted solution]

The 80C hasn't reached end of sale yet so there should be no problem to get support cover even if the previous contract expired some time ago.

I seem to remember there used to be a continous support policy which would backdate the start of the coverage to the end of the previous contract but limited to a maximum of six months.  Not sure if this is still the case...

Suggest you give their sales folks a call on the US toll free number to be sure.

[Dave_Hall · Accepted solution]

The 80C is nowhere on the Product Life Cycle list, so getting it renewed should doable.  I have been told via these forums that the renew will be from the date it expired (plus a day) to anywhere up to six months + a year subscription.  So in your case it could be 18 months.  If the 80C was purchased through a local dealer, you should try to go through them to renew it. 

I know with the smaller units, you can purchase renews directly via the support site through the Assets/Purchase Service link.  My personal account has this option but not my company's account (ID that I am using is not the primary though).

[ede_pfau · Accepted solution]

I can confirm that contracts for the 80C are readily available.

Contracts will be backdated but only for up to 6 months, even if the previous contract expired earlier than that. With a 1 yr renewal you will get at least 6 months of coverage.

IMHO the FortiCare contract is not what makes a Fortigate a Fortigate (no misstyping). It's the subscriptions for AV, IPS, AppControl, Webfilter (and some more). The UTM functions run particularily well on an 80C and make sense if the FGT is a gateway device.

BTW, I'd get rid of 2 of the three resellers you asked.

[hohosecure · Accepted solution]

The 80C hasn't reached end of sale yet so there should be no problem to get support cover even if the previous contract expired some time ago.

I seem to remember there used to be a continous support policy which would backdate the start of the coverage to the end of the previous contract but limited to a maximum of six months.  Not sure if this is still the case...

Suggest you give their sales folks a call on the US toll free number to be sure.

[Dave_Hall · Accepted solution]

The 80C is nowhere on the Product Life Cycle list, so getting it renewed should doable.  I have been told via these forums that the renew will be from the date it expired (plus a day) to anywhere up to six months + a year subscription.  So in your case it could be 18 months.  If the 80C was purchased through a local dealer, you should try to go through them to renew it. 

I know with the smaller units, you can purchase renews directly via the support site through the Assets/Purchase Service link.  My personal account has this option but not my company's account (ID that I am using is not the primary though).

[ede_pfau · Accepted solution]

I can confirm that contracts for the 80C are readily available.

Contracts will be backdated but only for up to 6 months, even if the previous contract expired earlier than that. With a 1 yr renewal you will get at least 6 months of coverage.

IMHO the FortiCare contract is not what makes a Fortigate a Fortigate (no misstyping). It's the subscriptions for AV, IPS, AppControl, Webfilter (and some more). The UTM functions run particularily well on an 80C and make sense if the FGT is a gateway device.

BTW, I'd get rid of 2 of the three resellers you asked.

[HMB]

ede_pfau wrote:

I can confirm that contracts for the 80C are readily available.

Good to know. Vielen Dank!

Contracts will be backdated but only for up to 6 months, even if the previous contract expired earlier than that. With a 1 yr renewal you will get at least 6 months of coverage.

That sounds fair. So I should be able to just buy say a one year 8x5 renewal and FortiNet then predates it to start at 6 months ago? Or is the renewal for out of support units a special product?

IMHO the FortiCare contract is not what makes a Fortigate a Fortigate (no misstyping). It's the subscriptions for AV, IPS, AppControl, Webfilter (and some more). The UTM functions run particularily well on an 80C and make sense if the FGT is a gateway device.

The 80C we have is a Rev1 with 512MB only, and I did activate the UTM trials and the unit is chocking under the memory footprint. In addition, we also bought a FortiWiFi 60D as the main firewall and UTM appliance, and the 80C will be moved to another location where only a firewall is needed. However, I would like to have support in case the device fails.

BTW, I'd get rid of 2 of the three resellers you asked.

It's probably a good idea. Unfortunately it seems the crop that represents FortiGate in the UK seems to be of similar caliber. Just getting a quote for something like a 60D bundle or a renewal requires calling them and talking to sales droids who only want to up-sell. In the US I can just buy it off the web, either from FortiNet directly (which seems to work in lots of countries but apparently not the UK) or from the online shop of a reseller.

[ede_pfau · Accepted solution]

So I should be able to just buy say a one year 8x5 renewal and FortiNet then predates it to start at 6 months ago? Or is the renewal for out of support units a special product?

Exactly. And there is just one FortiCare renewal, for 8x5 NBD, and one for 24x7 ND.

One good advice (even if not asked for): there have been a decent number of hardware failures because of faulty flash memory with the smaller models, including the 80C. Avoid logging to disk (which in this case means flash disk). Use logging into memory instead. This is not suitable for long term logging but can be quite useful over a period of 1-3 days, depending on the amount of log messages.

HW failures because of flash defects have lead to long discussions with Fortinet support as incident numbers mounted. In a way, logging to flash can be seen as 'misuse', especially after Fortinet has warned customers of the consequences, and has disabled logging to disk by default.

I usually increase the amount of logging memory to the maximum (10% of RAM size) and get decent coverage over the last days. If I need more I log to a syslog host or a FortiAnalyzer (I'm not a cloud lover - 3rd option is FortiCloud).

[HMB]

ede_pfau wrote:

Exactly. And there is just one FortiCare renewal, for 8x5 NBD, and one for 24x7 ND.

Thanks for the confirmation. I've ordered a 8x5 FortiCare renewal and am now waiting for it to be activated. I'll see how it pans out.

One good advice (even if not asked for): there have been a decent number of hardware failures because of faulty flash memory with the smaller models, including the 80C. Avoid logging to disk (which in this case means flash disk). Use logging into memory instead. This is not suitable for long term logging but can be quite useful over a period of 1-3 days, depending on the amount of log messages.

HW failures because of flash defects have lead to long discussions with Fortinet support as incident numbers mounted. In a way, logging to flash can be seen as 'misuse', especially after Fortinet has warned customers of the consequences, and has disabled logging to disk by default.

Thanks for the advice. I've already found the discussion re. logging in this forum. The device is at 5.0 something and doesn't seem to allow logging to local flash. Thankfully FortiNet offers free 1GB FortiCloud storage which is what I now use.

I usually increase the amount of logging memory to the maximum (10% of RAM size) and get decent coverage over the last days. If I need more I log to a syslog host or a FortiAnalyzer (I'm not a cloud lover - 3rd option is FortiCloud).

I guess at the moment I'll go with FortiCloud. The UTM trials bring the device regularly into conserve mode, and this even with memory logging disabled. I don't think there's much room for logging in that thing.

Again, thanks to all of you for your advice!

[Dave_Hall]

Re conserve mode; See KB #FD35127, which outlines steps to optimize memory usage on the lower-end fgt models with 512MB...Basically from what I can tell it looks like a step-by-step guide of the old conserve mode KB document.

[HMB]

Dave Hall wrote:

Re conserve mode; See KB #FD35127, which outlines steps to optimize memory usage on the lower-end fgt models with 512MB...Basically from what I can tell it looks like a step-by-step guide of the old conserve mode KB document.

I tried that, but the device is still running into conserve mode occasionally when the UTM options are enabled.

It's a bit of a shame, as the UTM performance seems to be really good on the 80C.

[ede_pfau]

You're welcome.

You do know that you will have to activate (register) the contract, using your customer account with Fortinet? Just to make sure...